To a certain extent, recognising the Kakuro puzzle and knowing what to do with it is a matter of luck. Now I hadn't seen one of those before, so it took me a while - but I did eventually find it by Googling. Later on, I showed it to the 16yo in the house and he recognised it immediately (but apparently wasn't aware of the rule that all the digits in any sum have to be different). It also wasn't that long (4 hours) before someone posted the name Kakuro into the comment thread, and that's a valid hint because it doesn't tell you what the answer is or how to calculate it, but it does at least tell you how to find the rules of the puzzle which the author is assuming you already knew.
The problem with the Listener puzzle for people who instinctively read music is how on earth to get "AR" out of two seemingly unrelated notes, the first of which is higher than the second, and which are neither 17 tones nor 17 semitones separated from each other (and the fact that one is flattened only makes things worse). So anyone who quickly saw how to sort that one out without going down several rabbit-holes was lucky in some sense.
I'd say this is not similar to spotting a barcode, because the skill in that one is spotting that the barcode even exists; once you see it, you can take logical paths towards finding out what it means. Here we know the code is in the music, but there are so many potential paths to take that it quickly becomes exasperating.
I made that comment because some people who were stuck and obviously knew a fair bit about music were making comments here that made it clear they were just starting on the right path but were seriously confused by this one detail. My comment was meant to nudge those people with a “no, it’s ok ... keep going”
When I thought about this I went back to see if anything else could be seen this way... I noticed in the Interpreter puzzle that a couple of the glyphs were inverted from what they should be - wondered if that might indicate something...
I saw absolutely no hints or even clues with regards to what direction you needed to go..
so.. those who argue that it wasn't luck... i don't understand..
it really is luck... granted more a "lucky guess" with basically confirmation that you solved it by it seeing it come out to a keyword and a known suffix.. but.. ya.. i'm calling it a lucky guess. simple. very little skill. even those who had no idea what a sharp or flat was could've manipulated the result to figure out what it could've meant..
because it sure as hell was not a semitone.
I am tired of those complaining about this challenge. or any challenge in fact. And disappointed. Is this how you would treat someone face to face?
It all culminates to "Your puzzle sucks! It doesn't give me what I need and it doesn't do what I want." The words that come to mind are entitled, brat, ungrateful.
Fair enough when you say, "Thanks for the puzzle, not my cup of tea, but it was still a good puzzle." Fair enough if you provide some constructive criticism, or arguments backed up with reasoning. But when you just complain, it's just whinge whinge whinge.
You don't know if the puzzle designer put their heart and soul, blood, sweat and tears into this. Only to release it globally and have people say "this sucks". That would hurt. This is not a corporation you are attacking, it's an individual. How you would feel if this was you?
Please have some grace.
I don't think this puzzle required too much luck, you either found it from desperation or sudden realisation. I found all the other puzzles a lot easier as there was a concept to them and a methodology that could be determined (apart from the random character conversions, which now just seem to be a trait rather than an actual puzzle to be solved). As such, the other puzzles had an organic way of solving it.
The Listener did not have an organic way to solve it, instead it had an organic way of finding 1000 ways not to succeed, which eventually leaves you with a dumbfounded solution. I found the previous puzzles easier because of the organic solution that could be determined, the Listener ended up just being more frustrating because it never opened itself up to anything unless you did the exact set path which most people wouldn't think of because there were no clues or puzzles to solve to be able to decode it.
Perhaps the puzzle itself was to fail many times before succeeding.
Regardless, many of us are newcomers to decoding and have zero experience in any of this. Many of us don't recognise these puzzles and aren't familiar with Niantic's riddles. Many of us are time poor as it is and struggle with spending hours or days on these things just to unlock some media. All these factors, and more, contribute to the general consensus that this puzzle was the least enjoyable.
I did enjoy reading about musical notation and musical cryptography, but was disappointed that this puzzle didn't utilise the concept of listening to music, rather than reading music. Listener vs. Reader, the theme to this puzzle wasn't aligned to the puzzle and that may have also added to the frustration.
Thank you @ATR0P0S for your time and effort. Although it seems most people thoroughly enjoyed your Interpreter puzzle more than your Listener puzzle, it was still interesting and I learned that I shouldn't make assumptions and that sometimes overthinking it doesn't help. Props to you for giving us this challenge.
@ATR0P0S I really enjoyed the Listener Puzzle.
I learned way more about music theory than I needed to for this puzzle; but hey learning is a good thing.
It was great because preconcieved notions on sheet music led most folks (myself included) on the wrong path.
That;s what I liked about it... You had to ignore your expectations to find the pattern.
I'd love to read these blog posts if you eventually decide to do them. Please share after you started writing them 👍️. I'll gladly offer some additional information if i can. I would have one or two very old 'puzzles' i could reconstruct in a similar fashion, if that would interest you. Unfortunately this forum does not seem to offer DMs.
@tkh7 I generally agree with you. However, I think that providing feedback is valuable as well (a bit more difficult here, since you don't want to spoil stuff). Sure, a 'this sucks' comment does not really help anyone. But I don't think 'this is my least favorite so far' is an offensive comment. In the end, absolutely we should remind ourselves that someone created those challenges and be respectful/grateful of it.
:-O Suddenly the bottom-left clue from Visionary is starting to make sense...
Kind words, constructive feedback, valid points, positive trend setting. 🍻
Irony is pretty sure i have the keyword and ending but the prefix is still messing with me lol guess i need to sleep
I legit have tried to count the notes, I have tried to write ABC on each line, even asked someone to translate it from music notes, I am 100% lost and worse is I'm on mobile so i swear I'm missing something
The lines are only half of the work space .
If you are still working on it by focusing on the suffix and you have part of the suffix but think that you're doing it wrong because some characters don't look right, keep going. Don't get derailed if a few characters don't look like what you expected.
Converting the notes is only the first step. There’s another translation that needs to be done after that.
Dont stop just because it doesn’t immediately make sense, keep going!!
@ATR0P0S FWIW, I really enjoyed this puzzle. It made me think. It made me work. I had to take chances and fail and try again and fail some more. I had to think outside the box. I had to eat a whole cheesecake and take a nap!! I had a great time working through this.
thank you to all the puzzle creators so far. These have all been a lot of fun.
Yep needed the sleep I just got it finished when I got up. Lol
Indeed, I have the letters indicated on my list of maybe useful for later items :-)
I still haven't gotten what the bottom right is, but as I don't think is needed, I haven't tried all that hard.
I think I see between the different factors why the number of solves goes down for each decode. The decodes feel like they are getting more obfuscated plus each time there are those who just decide to stop at that decode for one reason or another (maybe they finished maybe they didn't).
I've enjoyed them all so far though I will say this one annoyed me the most just because it felt weird compared to the others. However I will say it also reminded me of one of the others too. Either way.
The bottom right was specific to that puzzle basically just a word and letters needed for a Google search lol so unless it's bugging you I seriously doubt it will be helpful later but who knows... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yea, I'm keeping notes and files on each puzzle as I go, so it might just be good to have that in my notes.
I have discovered how to translate to letters of the alphabet. However I was stuck on how to decipher the numbers. And I don't find the key word of the challenge either.
I feel that I approached, but that I was very close to deciphering the code.
remember again how you completed the dreamer and skeptic to find numbers 😁
If you translated the musical notes correctly, the keyword will jump out you. After that you will still need to complete one more step before you reach the keyword. Don't give up!
Massively enjoyed this, and all, the puzzles so far. I've learned new stuff at every step of each one.
My musical part-knowledge held me up and sent me down any number of rabbit holes!
I really appreciated that this and The Skeptic didn't require a lot of apps, programs or hairy computer knowledge. That made them both more accessible in my eyes.
I definitely feel smarter 🤣 and more accomplished with each one I solve.
I'm especially pleased this one has not been widely leaked (yet :/ ), which takes the joy out of it for those who don't solve it quickly or have time to start on it straightaway.
I am still helping people who have not yet solved work through this. If this is you, can message me HemlokHex#4451 on discord for a few hints and some encouragement.
I had to put it down for a few days. Haven't completed it yet but I plan to pick it back up in a little while. I recall that I had a few string possibilities and I need to apply another step to.
Your efforts in the fields of naps and cheesecake eating are very much appreciated!! 🤩 nom cheesecake, nom it all!
I initially went down some serious rabbit holes on this one. While I don't have a lot of experience with music ciphers,(not a lot of people using them these days,) I have studied their history a bit. I'm glad this one wasn't musically complex. With all of the factors of time, tone, and frequency they easily become some of the most permutable ciphers around. So 'easy' sayers beware, you just might get the nightmare music cipher one day.😀
For those interested in this topic I'd highly recommend reading Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid by Douglas Hofstadter. Its a classic.
And as always, Thanks to the creators.
@ATR0P0S nice done creating a puzzle where it actually seamed harder to solve because I used to play an instrument and read too much into the notes - and still, some musical knowledge was needed.
( but I hated it for a while 🙈😁)