What is it section update please.

hoffenheimhoffenheim ✭✭
edited February 3 in Wayfarer

Can the following be added as submissions options for the "What is it" section?

  1. Pergolas
  2. Pavilions
  3. Fishing Areas
  4. Indoor Play Areas
  5. Coin Operated Machines
  6. Trail Marker - No name
  7. Charity Organizations
  8. Bird houses
  9. Bird Bath Water Fountains
  10. Mall Entrance
  11. Park Entrance
  12. Community Cernter
  13. Church Signs
  14. Monument Signs
  15. Guest Services Centers
  16. Tourist Service Centers
  17. Indoor Unique Architectures and Lobbies
  18. Skylights
  19. Decorative Canopies for Buildings
  20. Decorative Glass
  21. Park Signs (For all signs at parks that are not educational.)
  22. Apartment Name Signs (Not on a building)
  23. Community Name Signs (Not on a building)
  24. Fire-station Name Signs (Not on a building)
  25. Horseshoe Pits
  26. Billard Tables
  27. Masoleums - (Unique Architecture at a Cemetery)
  28. Open Space Parks
  29. Dog Parks
  30. Obstacle Courses
  31. Paintball Recreation Areas
  32. Laser Tag
  33. Trampoline Centers
  34. Display Cases (Indoor submissions with various displays)
  35. Exhibits - (Museums, colleges, mall, etc... that have special exhibits for displays)
  36. Dart Board Areas
  37. Cornhole Areas
  38. Outdoor Board Game Areas
  39. Senior Assisted Living Centers
  40. Firepit Areas (Stone or Brick Permanent types)


If you have others, feel free to share.

@NianticCasey This should be fairly easy to update. Can you also get this in the works?

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Comments

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 3

    Some of these things are "reject" meaning usually you wouldn't need to have it in the what is it section if you are rejecting the nomination.


    Some of these are great suggestions but some are either already in the system as something very close or are things that should be rejected,

    Rejected:

    Birdhouse

    Fire Pit

    Fishing Area (Unless its signage then use Information Sign or Nature Sign)

    Mall Entrance

    Mausoleums (Should be rejected unless its a notable person)

    Bird baths


    Things that already exist:

    Community Center (Recreation Center)

    Church Sign represents the church so just use church

    Park sign represents the park so just use park

    Indoor Play area (Playground Structure)

    Indoor Unique Architecture, would still just be Unique Architecture

    Open Space Park is still a park

    Dectorative Glass (depending on what you are talking about would be stained glass or another selection is art)


    Edit: In Most situations a Neighborehood or Apartment Sign should be rejected as well.

  • hoffenheimhoffenheim ✭✭
    edited February 3

    These are for the "what is it" section and not an approval criteria. Are you rushing through stuff today @AgentB0ss? Things can be reviewed and still categorized doesn't mean they will be approved unless they have the correct requirements to be approved. Since Niantic is already working on updating criteria, I don't see a problem with these. Ones that have criteria should have a name in "What is it" section. If we are creating a database, than we shouldn't be upset about using more accurate sorting options for when Niantic decides to cut back portals, it is easier to prevent ones mislabeled as the wrong thing. Example if niantic deems the church buildings are no longer eligible than we should still be allowed the Church signs as a separate category for things.

    Just because some of them are on your typical reject list doesn't make them not valid to others.

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 3

    Right but if you are rejecting(1*) a nomination you are not able to fill out the What is it section. So if something is 95% or more of the time going to be rejected then it really doesn't need to be in the What is it section.


    I agree the what is it section needs stuff added to it overall but ive also heard of Waypoint nominators confusing the what is it section with a list of things that are acceptable. So adding in items that are normally a reject is not a great idea.


    Some of these things are wonderful and definitely should be added. Such as Dog Parks, Park Games(Per ****, Perm Pingpong, Perm Horseshoes, etc), Billards and stuff as well are good adds.


    Also your note saying if churches became not eligible having a church sign category makes sense. If churches are no longer eligible I would assume the sign for said church wouldnt be either. As this would likely stem from complaints at people being at the church.



    Edit: In the same vein I believe certain things should be reduced from the categories. Tennis Courts, Baseball Fields, and Athletic Fields should be condensed into one 1 (Athletic Court/Field) or something along those lines.

  • JasonwhutJasonwhut ✭✭✭
    edited February 3

    Soccer Field

    Basketball Court

    Cricket Pitch

    Futsal Court

    Fitness Structure (to include stations and areas)

    Scenic Overlook (platforms and signs)

    Post edited by Jasonwhut on
  • hoffenheimhoffenheim ✭✭
    edited February 3

    "Bird houses" and "Bird baths" at a "Nature Center" or a "Park" seems like a valid reason for a portal. You go to a nature center or park to see the nature and wild life. Birds are apart of nature and wildlife.

    Yes, if Churches have a subcategory of things that are allowed at churches, we could have buildings being not eligible as people could say it interferes with EMS and access to the church. Ingress agents spend less time at portals with smaller group sizes. A Pokemon go raid at a church could have complaints with large groups blocking the church entrance. Some other buildings need subcategories. Malls are another one that should have subcategories for them as well. Seeing a church category, and it has crosses, bells, stain glass, statues, paintings, murals, playgrounds, pavilions, Baptist Pools, cornerstones, etc... I would think it would be more helpful to people to sub-categorize in a their own category.

    With time everything was once rejected because nothing had criteria. A year from today, we could have a totally different set of criteria that is allowed. Preparing and asking for more subcategories seems like a good idea especially when some of these things are submitted by players currently.

  • Disc Golf Courses would be another great one.

  • JasonwhutJasonwhut ✭✭✭

    I have never treated the 'What is it' as any kind of what's acceptable list and I don't think it was meant to be. If some of the things in the list were actually Ineligible like apartment signs it would be helpful feedback to submitters if their email said Does Not Meet Criteria/Apartment Signs. If they wanted the Wayspots and rejected POI for some other project then a rejected one labeled as Apartment Sign could be useful for that.


  • What is wrong with Apartment signs? They are not in wayfarer, saying to reject them. Apartments are allowed portals in playgrounds, swimming pools, and pavilions. Why would a sign be no different? When we are allowed to have signs for an existing waypoint, if they are a significant distance apart. You are approving "Apartment Complex Playground", what is the difference on "Apartment Complex Sign"?

  • @AgentB0ss You don't feel that niantic should sub-categorize athletic fields? Soccer fields are some of the most skeptical portals possible, as the goals are move-able and moved daily. If Niantic deems down the road to eliminate a soccer field, I would rather keep all of the other athletic fields.

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭

    What criteria does an apartment sign meet to be acceptable?

  • "A sign for an existing waypoint" criteria. If a swimming pool, playground or pavilion for the apartment complex is already approved. Than the name sign for the apartment complex is valid and allowed now too.

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭

    Per Niantic AMA on Athletic fields they are acceptable as long as their is an object to tie the POI to.


    Plus there is such thing as too many options, its called the Paradox of choice. The more options there are the more stressful or harder it is to categorize as you agonize over the correct choice.


    While I believe the list is missing some important things, i also don't believe everything needs a direct single defined item. Picnic Shelter, Ramada, Gazebo, Pavilion, Pergola all serve the same purpose so they should be categorized the same as "Covered Shelter" or something.

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 3

    A sign for something that as eligible makes sense. If they are enough distance away in most situations you are not going to have both a Church and Church sign.

    "Signs for locations/objects that are already existing Wayspots - Eligible, if they are a significant distance from the object or location. For example, a sign for a monument could be a separate Wayspot than the monument itself. If a sign for Wayspot is nearby the Wayspot itself, it can be used as a supplementary photo for the existing Wayspot."


    Now also with that being said. You are listing things that are eligible for nomination like churches and playgrounds. However, an apartment complex is not an eligible nomination, stuff at an apartment complex can be eligible such as a playground or pool but the apartment complex its self doesnt meet any criteria and neither would its sign.


    Now there are examples of apartment or neighborhood signs that could be eligible if they are very historic or very unique/artistic. However, a run of the mill neighborhood sign with no history and not artistic is not eligible as it doesn't meet any criteria.


    Edit: I do understand the confusion because its not directly in Wayfarer help yet.

  • Nothing says to reject them in wayfarer. I disagree with you, you are submitting and approving a portal created for example as "Hampton Apartments Playground" you are creating the reason for the apartment sign to be eligible. As you are creating the existence of the Apartment Complex by naming it in the playground.

  • JasonwhutJasonwhut ✭✭✭

    Sign for something else doesn't make sense in the what is it because it references something else entirely. Type that into doesn't meet criteria is that's what you want to vote.

  • OchemistOchemist ✭✭✭

    This is a very precipitous slippery ****. My grocery store has a portal inside it. Does make the sign for the store eligible? If the Fake Street Neighborhood Playground is a portal, does that mean the Fake St. sign is eligible?

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭

    The playground and apartment sign are not related. The above Wayfarer help says "a sign for a monument could be a separate Wayspot than the monument itself." The playground is not the apartment complex despite being at the apartment complex. Also the sign still doesn't meet any eligible requirements.

  • "Signs for locations that are already existing Wayspots". Eligible, if they are a significant distance from the object or location. 

    If you create a few portals for different things at the apartment complex, you have already created the guidance for the apartment sign to be valid. As it is a sign for the location that already has wayspots.

  • OchemistOchemist ✭✭✭
    edited February 3

    Nothing says to reject them in wayfarer. 

    It did say to reject them in the old OPR guidance, NianticCasey said they weren't eligible in a post here, and also said that old AMAs were still valid.

    However, if that's not relevant for you, the guidance in Wayfarer isn't a list of stuff that's not eligible, it's a list of things that are eligible. In other words, just because something isn't prohibited in the Wayfarer guidance doesn't mean it's allowed. it still needs to meet one or more of criteria they have laid out.


    Edit: That last paragraph wasn't well-worded. Here's another try:

    Just because something isn't prohibited by the guidance in Wayfarer, doesn't mean it's affirmatively eligible; it still needs to meet one or more of the criteria they have laid out.

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭

    By your logic you are saying if an Apartment Complex has no Pool, Playground, Pergola, Gazebo or anything that Apartment Complex sign would be ineligible?

  • So you are saying "What is it" is all stuff eligible for wayspots?

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭

    The "What is it" section is not part of the Wayfarer Help, its part of the wayfarer review.

  • Yes. That is how I understand "Signs for locations that are already existing Wayspots". Because the sign wouldn't have a reason to be eligible then without something already being a wayspot. If the swimming pool, playground or pergola were existing wayspots, than yes the apartment sign is eligible under this section of the rules. As the apartment complex is the location for all of the portals on the property of the apartment complex.

  • OchemistOchemist ✭✭✭

    No, I wasn't referring to the "What is it" section at all. I was referring to the Wayfarer instructions/guidance. I don't consider the "What is it" section to be anything other than a laundry list of things and places, some of which are eligible and some of which aren't.

  • AgentB0ssAgentB0ss ✭✭✭✭✭

    Thats Denying the Antecedent logical fallacy. A waypoint would be eligible regardless of other local waypoints.

  • Okay than can you edit your comments then. This is strictly for "What is it" Section.

  • GearGliderGearGlider ✭✭✭✭✭

    NianticCasey said they're already working on adding a lot of calrifications to the criteria update page. At least hold off on making a 50+ item list until after the first update.

  • OchemistOchemist ✭✭✭

    Huh??? My comment was in direct response to your comments that revolved around this this statement:

    >>"Signs for locations that are already existing Wayspots". Eligible, if they are a significant distance from the object or location. 

    This has nothing to do with the "What is it" section and everything to do with the guidelines. You were the one who took it in this direction.

  • How do you read this then. ""Signs for locations that are already existing Wayspots" Eligible, if they are a significant distance from the object or location. 

    Are you going to disagree that a Apartment Sign is typically far enough away from the playground, swimming pool, or pergola? They are usually substantial enough distance away from them in my personal experience. Or are you disagreeing that they are not existing wayspots on the apartment complex to deem the sign eligible?

  • Holy heck, why would an apartment complex sign but tied to anything else at the apartment complex. So now if that sign says free HBO, does that make my TV eligible, since its on a sign you say is eligible.

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