However, periodically you do need to intercede to root out the statistical outliers. I recognize that Timer does not represent the group of reviewers I disagree with, and as much as it pains me to give him credit, I don't believe he's doing this in bad faith. I say that to mean that I read the legal document regarding an argument of his and realized that this is just who he is and I disagree with most of his worldview.
That said, we're not talking about whether or not a pool or a McDonald's playplace should be accepted here. We're arguing what constitutes school grounds. @CrispenWah's point, or the one I gathered anyway, is that there are very steadfast things they need to correct so that it doesn't spread. If we're debating the merits of candidates within a standard deviation or two on the Bell curve of subjective candidates, they need not jump in and clarify.
But we're fighting a losing battle in convincing someone that there shouldn't be candidates on private property, school grounds, hospitals, and however other many clearly defined criteria for unacceptability. I'm not even considering his electrical tower submission in the park here, I'm talking about the bench in front of the elementary school. One of those is wrong, and one of those is wrong enough to warrant at least some intervention.
He is absolutely doing this in bad faith, he actually knows what is right and wrong. We’ve proven between this thread and the previous dozen we’ve dealt with him he only cares about numero uno. He has no desire to change and just wants to cause chaos and try to get his selfish desires.
Remember he fully advocates that electrical towers should be portals and that they are safe...
I think the big problem he has, and that pretty much every on The Silph Road has too which we'll all experience once PoGo gets reviews, is that he can't disconnect the POI database from AR gameplay at a fundamental level. This seems to be the big recurring problem. We read the guidelines and interpret them in the context of what Niantic wants long-term for non-video game applications, and people like Gabriel only focus on gameplay concerns. Hence why so many reviews I get have a supporting statement like, "Has tons of parking for raid groups and the owner plays too so he won't mind," and why Gabriel thinks drinking fountains should be portals or why he thinks a gym on school property would ever be a good idea.
It's not so much bad faith as just a fundamental disagreement on the purpose of OPR.
Could be that you guys are fundamentally flawed..... Yet you fail to see it? You guys proved how bad OPR is... Your bias is wrong on everything. You assume one thing and it turns out to be another.... Like for example.... Sports fields are publicly accessible are allowed....
NONE of us are arguing about "sports fields". Well, except you.
We ALL believe that sports fields can be portals. Basketball, tennis, football, the other football, baseball, cricket, and many other things. These are allowed to be POIs, always have been. The most recent clarification to the clarifications in these wayfarer docs amount to "signs are preferred for these, but if there ain't one they still can be submitted". I paraphrase of course.
We are otherwise just chatting amongst ourselves, mostly ignoring you, about the other fact. Schools are 100% absolutely forbidden areas. It cannot matter that "some" times the property is able to be used for other things, only that very strictly "all" of the times the location is still part of the school grounds.
The mixed-use information you yourself keep posting, says that your municipality has found a way to provide more facilities to the schools than they would otherwise have. Because, you know, schools have limited budgets. This is great for the schools, not so much for the in-game POIs we all crave.
Where do you get that from? I said sport fields. Not others. Sports fields are allowed if publicly accessible. Dual use agreement was established in 1952, want to call Doc and see if he can take you back in time to change the local laws? Publicly accessible means open to the community. Due to the dual use agreement they are allowed in baltimore county.
I don't think he fires up OPR or this forum because it's funny to him. I don't think he's a troll for the hilarity of it. I think this is the way he is in everyday life, and I think that his worldview is skewed from the consensus. I'm not his doctor, so out of respect I'm not going to half-attempt a diagnosis or throw out theories. But as I read the commentary on that legal document, it was very eye opening to me because he engaged in legal processes and used the exact same incorrectly-applied precedents and justifications for his mediation as he does for stuff here.
There are just people out in the world that don't get it. He's one of them. Him not getting it isn't a result of him being a tool, it's a result of a fundamental difference in the lens that he uses to see the guidelines and the lens we use. He's not the vocal minority. He's the vocal singularity.
If they wanted no school sports fields they would of clarified just like playgrounds.... Publicly accessible is allowed for sports fields. They are allowed in Baltimore, County. MD. Sports fields are clearly marked no PRP for 40m. Yet you can't put schools? I disagree with everyone's opinion and sports fields that are publicly accessible are allowed. Dual use agreement stands for Baltimore County, MD. End of story.
Any further comments on the topic will have to be dealt to Niantic. What is written is what is written. They are allowed everywhere they are publicly accessible. Which for Baltimore County Maryland is on schools.
Any further comments on the topic will have to be dealt to Niantic. What is written is what is written. They are allowed everywhere they are publicly accessible. Which for Baltimore County Maryland is on schools.
@AgentB0ss This is exactly what I'm talking about. All of us are reading the same document, but not all of us are understanding the gradients here.
For one, we recognize that an agreement within a municipality doesn't have affect over Niantic's guidelines. But he doesn't get that. He sees that parks are allowed, and the city says this is a park, so it's allowed. The city didn't even say that it's not school grounds, it just says the parks department is responsible for the upkeep of school property, which I assume is some sort of way of consolidating grounds maintenance into one place for more efficiency and cost savings.
And this is where the gaslighting is happening. He's forcing us to explain the reality of the scenario over and over again until we have to prove the definition of "is" to justify a simple concept that @RedSoloCup could easily squash by saying "Niantic defines school grounds as the property surrounding a school, and classifies all POI candidates on school grounds as unacceptable." But they haven't.
I did with the sign of the school... parks and recreation centers are allowed....
Oh wow. It's a school and a park! Amazing. County has an agreement. The grounds are publicly accessible as a result of the agreement. Sorry folks you are all wrong. School building is off limits. The sports fields are allowed....
Doesnt matter where they are, they have to be publicly accessible.... someone prove to me how they are not publicly accessible? How about that....
If it was on time it wouldn't of been an issue. As it stands I don't need to prove anything as they are allowed in Baltimore county.... technically you would have to prove why they are not allowed. And saying it's not written with a new roll out that clearly they thought about wisely and said publicly accessible and not on within 40m of prp. And a few lines below on playgrounds saying no schools.... hmmm. Dont think any of you are correct.
It's a shame you were posting in this thread exclusively the hour and a half the AMA was open. It's almost like you don't want it clarified that school grounds can't have your pokestops on them.
Answers
Exactly this, he literally was marked Abuse so much they added a disagree button...
And where does it list those specifically as being banned?
If possible @TimerCIock would put a waypoint on his illegible concrete pad...
I completely agree with you.
However, periodically you do need to intercede to root out the statistical outliers. I recognize that Timer does not represent the group of reviewers I disagree with, and as much as it pains me to give him credit, I don't believe he's doing this in bad faith. I say that to mean that I read the legal document regarding an argument of his and realized that this is just who he is and I disagree with most of his worldview.
That said, we're not talking about whether or not a pool or a McDonald's playplace should be accepted here. We're arguing what constitutes school grounds. @CrispenWah's point, or the one I gathered anyway, is that there are very steadfast things they need to correct so that it doesn't spread. If we're debating the merits of candidates within a standard deviation or two on the Bell curve of subjective candidates, they need not jump in and clarify.
But we're fighting a losing battle in convincing someone that there shouldn't be candidates on private property, school grounds, hospitals, and however other many clearly defined criteria for unacceptability. I'm not even considering his electrical tower submission in the park here, I'm talking about the bench in front of the elementary school. One of those is wrong, and one of those is wrong enough to warrant at least some intervention.
He is absolutely doing this in bad faith, he actually knows what is right and wrong. We’ve proven between this thread and the previous dozen we’ve dealt with him he only cares about numero uno. He has no desire to change and just wants to cause chaos and try to get his selfish desires.
Remember he fully advocates that electrical towers should be portals and that they are safe...
I think the big problem he has, and that pretty much every on The Silph Road has too which we'll all experience once PoGo gets reviews, is that he can't disconnect the POI database from AR gameplay at a fundamental level. This seems to be the big recurring problem. We read the guidelines and interpret them in the context of what Niantic wants long-term for non-video game applications, and people like Gabriel only focus on gameplay concerns. Hence why so many reviews I get have a supporting statement like, "Has tons of parking for raid groups and the owner plays too so he won't mind," and why Gabriel thinks drinking fountains should be portals or why he thinks a gym on school property would ever be a good idea.
It's not so much bad faith as just a fundamental disagreement on the purpose of OPR.
Sports fields are allowed in public accessible places.... say it one more time with me.
Pooping in the middle of a park and calling it a man made object doesn't mean it should be a portal
May or May not have done that once... Desperate times as a child.
Should
've submitted it.
"Banned locations" override ALL other rules for POI submission. Say it one more time with me.
Oh wait don't, I'd rather not have to repeat myself. Or you yourself.
Could be that you guys are fundamentally flawed..... Yet you fail to see it? You guys proved how bad OPR is... Your bias is wrong on everything. You assume one thing and it turns out to be another.... Like for example.... Sports fields are publicly accessible are allowed....
Picnic sites are allowed. (There is a category for them in the Review process....)
Sports fields have always been allowed.
If their location is on k12 property, the k12 rule overrides any acceptance criteria, and it becomes a rejection.
The classification list, is not a list of acceptable submissions, it's just a list.
That's why schools are also listed.
NONE of us are arguing about "sports fields". Well, except you.
We ALL believe that sports fields can be portals. Basketball, tennis, football, the other football, baseball, cricket, and many other things. These are allowed to be POIs, always have been. The most recent clarification to the clarifications in these wayfarer docs amount to "signs are preferred for these, but if there ain't one they still can be submitted". I paraphrase of course.
We are otherwise just chatting amongst ourselves, mostly ignoring you, about the other fact. Schools are 100% absolutely forbidden areas. It cannot matter that "some" times the property is able to be used for other things, only that very strictly "all" of the times the location is still part of the school grounds.
The mixed-use information you yourself keep posting, says that your municipality has found a way to provide more facilities to the schools than they would otherwise have. Because, you know, schools have limited budgets. This is great for the schools, not so much for the in-game POIs we all crave.
Where do you get that from? I said sport fields. Not others. Sports fields are allowed if publicly accessible. Dual use agreement was established in 1952, want to call Doc and see if he can take you back in time to change the local laws? Publicly accessible means open to the community. Due to the dual use agreement they are allowed in baltimore county.
Sorry, I didn't flesh this opinion out.
I don't think he fires up OPR or this forum because it's funny to him. I don't think he's a troll for the hilarity of it. I think this is the way he is in everyday life, and I think that his worldview is skewed from the consensus. I'm not his doctor, so out of respect I'm not going to half-attempt a diagnosis or throw out theories. But as I read the commentary on that legal document, it was very eye opening to me because he engaged in legal processes and used the exact same incorrectly-applied precedents and justifications for his mediation as he does for stuff here.
There are just people out in the world that don't get it. He's one of them. Him not getting it isn't a result of him being a tool, it's a result of a fundamental difference in the lens that he uses to see the guidelines and the lens we use. He's not the vocal minority. He's the vocal singularity.
If they wanted no school sports fields they would of clarified just like playgrounds.... Publicly accessible is allowed for sports fields. They are allowed in Baltimore, County. MD. Sports fields are clearly marked no PRP for 40m. Yet you can't put schools? I disagree with everyone's opinion and sports fields that are publicly accessible are allowed. Dual use agreement stands for Baltimore County, MD. End of story.
Any further comments on the topic will have to be dealt to Niantic. What is written is what is written. They are allowed everywhere they are publicly accessible. Which for Baltimore County Maryland is on schools.
Then request Niantic to close the thread.
I second the motion that we have all already heard everything to hear on the subject(s).
You're entitled to your opinion.
You're entitled to be wrong.
I have written it, so it is written, now it is gospel.
Any further comments on the topic will have to be dealt to Niantic. What is written is what is written. They are allowed everywhere they are publicly accessible. Which for Baltimore County Maryland is on schools.
@AgentB0ss This is exactly what I'm talking about. All of us are reading the same document, but not all of us are understanding the gradients here.
For one, we recognize that an agreement within a municipality doesn't have affect over Niantic's guidelines. But he doesn't get that. He sees that parks are allowed, and the city says this is a park, so it's allowed. The city didn't even say that it's not school grounds, it just says the parks department is responsible for the upkeep of school property, which I assume is some sort of way of consolidating grounds maintenance into one place for more efficiency and cost savings.
And this is where the gaslighting is happening. He's forcing us to explain the reality of the scenario over and over again until we have to prove the definition of "is" to justify a simple concept that @RedSoloCup could easily squash by saying "Niantic defines school grounds as the property surrounding a school, and classifies all POI candidates on school grounds as unacceptable." But they haven't.
I did with the sign of the school... parks and recreation centers are allowed....
Oh wow. It's a school and a park! Amazing. County has an agreement. The grounds are publicly accessible as a result of the agreement. Sorry folks you are all wrong. School building is off limits. The sports fields are allowed....
Doesnt matter where they are, they have to be publicly accessible.... someone prove to me how they are not publicly accessible? How about that....
I'm going to deviate from the cats norm and try something else:
Wow it sure is neat you like to show that image around to everyone except in the Andrew Krug AMA where it could be definitively answered.
If it was on time it wouldn't of been an issue. As it stands I don't need to prove anything as they are allowed in Baltimore county.... technically you would have to prove why they are not allowed. And saying it's not written with a new roll out that clearly they thought about wisely and said publicly accessible and not on within 40m of prp. And a few lines below on playgrounds saying no schools.... hmmm. Dont think any of you are correct.
It's a shame you were posting in this thread exclusively the hour and a half the AMA was open. It's almost like you don't want it clarified that school grounds can't have your pokestops on them.
I dont need it.... I just have to show they are publicly accessible to be approved. Only restriction on sports fields is away from prp by 40m.