However, they would need to be carefully crafted, and some benefits to actually achieving said levels without imbalanced play against low level players.
Currently a level 8 player, with skill, can give a level 16 player a hard time.
We don't want to see a level 8 player crushed by a level 20 character.
Recursion level should probably remain at 16.
Currently i can brag i have 150mill AP, turning this into whatever level does nothing other than assign a new arbitrary number to stats.
You have a solution looking for a problem.
If you want to add something to strive for besides getting every Onyx badg etc, Niantic would need to add balanced new features.
Lol. No. If you don't do the work, you don't get the credit. It's significantly easier to get 40,000,000 after reaching level 16 than it is climbing back from the beginning.
If Niantic needs its players to spell these out in great detail for them, they need to hire some game designers and visionaries, get off their tushes, and do some real work. Develop an understanding of what the players actually want, not what they say they want.
It's been 5 years since there were significant insights into player motivation. Waiting for that doesn't seem to be working.
Skill trees have been mentioned in this thread, but I think they are enough of a separate discussion to warrant a separate thread, so I started one with my random thoughts on some ways it could be implemented.
I don't want any extra levels. One of the benefits of reaching level 16 is that you can "join a club" with other agents who've also made this achievement. Level 16 is quite difficult for the average player, but it's achievable in reasonable time with a bit of effort. Having a level 24 that only half a dozen players worldwide have achieved in 8 years of the game's existence is just insane. Besides, if
Recursing has always been essentially meaningless 'make work', to provide a simple 40 Million AP counter, for players
then surely the 1 billion AP to get to level 24 is even more meaningless 'make work'. People who like gaining levels tend to recurse to get that benefit. People who don't like gaining levels won't benefit from levels 17-24. Instead they can concentrate on levelling up their badges (including the multiple-onyx that comes with recursion) and/or gaining significant AP milestones. I'm just not convinced that adding extra levels will magically revitalise the game. Some people will get bored and quit either way. Some people will carry on either way. The people who wake up to the game to reach to level 24 will undoubtedly be balanced out by people who see it as too much work and quit.
I am not in favour of getting rid of recursion (yeah okay the five people who reach level 24 will have the opportunity to recurse - big deal). Handing the (albeit limited) benefits of recursion to anyone who got 40m AP is a bit of a slap for anyone who did actually do the work to go through the levels again. IF there are to be any extra levels then let's base them on (a) having at least 40m AP in the current recursion; (b) having at least N AP all-time; (c) having at least Q recursions (with Q being a small number, maybe 1 for several of the levels). Yup, I hear you that some people who didn't recurse might be upset, but as noted above these are a minority of players; and in most cases they are players with lots of AP for whom a recursion would be less work than for the average player.
then surely the 1 billion AP to get to level 24 is even more meaningless 'make work'.
As was illustrated early on in the thread, people find it a lot easier to resist "playing to a level" if they're required to push a button before they start again.
Pokemon Go levels for 41-50 is a trainwreck. They blended in the worst parts of badges that we used for levels 9-16. I'm not in agreement for upping the levels just for the sake of it and Go is definitely an example of that.
I hate that pogo system too, tons of xp and challanges i refuse to do.
I would prefer a secound leveling system on top with infinite levels. So people can show their 12342 lvls. Every levelup some nice items, every 100 levels some "u are awesome" cosmetic stuff.
If thats not enough, add seasons. Every season these levels get a reset. rewards for reaching specific levels and Top 10 players get some kind of top 10 rewards. Maybe add some season specific challanges or missions for extra content.
Comments
I'll add a final comment.
Extra levels may be a good idea.
However, they would need to be carefully crafted, and some benefits to actually achieving said levels without imbalanced play against low level players.
Currently a level 8 player, with skill, can give a level 16 player a hard time.
We don't want to see a level 8 player crushed by a level 20 character.
Recursion level should probably remain at 16.
Currently i can brag i have 150mill AP, turning this into whatever level does nothing other than assign a new arbitrary number to stats.
You have a solution looking for a problem.
If you want to add something to strive for besides getting every Onyx badg etc, Niantic would need to add balanced new features.
Lol. No. If you don't do the work, you don't get the credit. It's significantly easier to get 40,000,000 after reaching level 16 than it is climbing back from the beginning.
If Niantic needs its players to spell these out in great detail for them, they need to hire some game designers and visionaries, get off their tushes, and do some real work. Develop an understanding of what the players actually want, not what they say they want.
It's been 5 years since there were significant insights into player motivation. Waiting for that doesn't seem to be working.
Skill trees have been mentioned in this thread, but I think they are enough of a separate discussion to warrant a separate thread, so I started one with my random thoughts on some ways it could be implemented.
https://community.ingress.com/en/discussion/13740/skill-trees-as-a-method-of-player-advancement/p1?new=1
For me recursing means lose permanent lvl 16xm tank, i refuse to let go of that i guess im old school.
I don't want any extra levels. One of the benefits of reaching level 16 is that you can "join a club" with other agents who've also made this achievement. Level 16 is quite difficult for the average player, but it's achievable in reasonable time with a bit of effort. Having a level 24 that only half a dozen players worldwide have achieved in 8 years of the game's existence is just insane. Besides, if
Recursing has always been essentially meaningless 'make work', to provide a simple 40 Million AP counter, for players
then surely the 1 billion AP to get to level 24 is even more meaningless 'make work'. People who like gaining levels tend to recurse to get that benefit. People who don't like gaining levels won't benefit from levels 17-24. Instead they can concentrate on levelling up their badges (including the multiple-onyx that comes with recursion) and/or gaining significant AP milestones. I'm just not convinced that adding extra levels will magically revitalise the game. Some people will get bored and quit either way. Some people will carry on either way. The people who wake up to the game to reach to level 24 will undoubtedly be balanced out by people who see it as too much work and quit.
I am not in favour of getting rid of recursion (yeah okay the five people who reach level 24 will have the opportunity to recurse - big deal). Handing the (albeit limited) benefits of recursion to anyone who got 40m AP is a bit of a slap for anyone who did actually do the work to go through the levels again. IF there are to be any extra levels then let's base them on (a) having at least 40m AP in the current recursion; (b) having at least N AP all-time; (c) having at least Q recursions (with Q being a small number, maybe 1 for several of the levels). Yup, I hear you that some people who didn't recurse might be upset, but as noted above these are a minority of players; and in most cases they are players with lots of AP for whom a recursion would be less work than for the average player.
then surely the 1 billion AP to get to level 24 is even more meaningless 'make work'.
As was illustrated early on in the thread, people find it a lot easier to resist "playing to a level" if they're required to push a button before they start again.
Pokemon Go levels for 41-50 is a trainwreck. They blended in the worst parts of badges that we used for levels 9-16. I'm not in agreement for upping the levels just for the sake of it and Go is definitely an example of that.
I haven't levelled past 40 in PoGo because I don't raid.
But this post has interesting alternate ideas, if it can balance power gains with new player's ability to not quit in frustration at power imbalance.
I hate that pogo system too, tons of xp and challanges i refuse to do.
I would prefer a secound leveling system on top with infinite levels. So people can show their 12342 lvls. Every levelup some nice items, every 100 levels some "u are awesome" cosmetic stuff.
If thats not enough, add seasons. Every season these levels get a reset. rewards for reaching specific levels and Top 10 players get some kind of top 10 rewards. Maybe add some season specific challanges or missions for extra content.
@NianticBrian
Why are you bothering him over this. I guarantee you he's followed the conversation whether new levels are planned or not
Last time we got new lvls was in 2014 so It been a while since last time.